Subject: Re: AZTLAN list: who are the "American Isolationists"? From: email@example.com (Yuri Kuchinsky) Date: 1997/02/17 Message-ID: <firstname.lastname@example.org> Newsgroups: sci.archaeology,sci.anthropology,sci.archaeology.mesoamerican Peter van Rossum (email@example.com) wrote: : In article <firstname.lastname@example.org> email@example.com (Yuri Kuchinsky) writes: [begin quote] >From David H. Kelley, AN ESSAY ON PRE-COLUMBIAN CONTACTS BETWEEN THE AMERICAS AND OTHER AREAS, in RACE, DISCOURSE, AND THE ORIGIN OF THE AMERICAS, Smithsonian, 1995 Comparative mythology is tied to comparative religious studies, to the role of astronomy in ancient religion, and to comparative calendrics. All such comparisons involve partial systemic correspondences. Such evidence is quite acceptable to linguists, for they are constantly dealing with parts of systems that have themselves frequently undergone regular and specifiable changes. Such partial systemic correspondences are disliked by archaeologists... (p. 118) I have done a great deal of work on Mesoamerican and Eurasian parallels in calendar system. These parallels fall entirely in the realm of partial systemic correspondences. Of the day-names of the Mesoamerican calendar, all have parallels in one of four Eurasian systems, three of which are attested in northern India. (p. 119) [end quote] So there you go, Peter. To say that all these are "coincidences" is truly going into the realm of "science fiction". The Aliens shouldn't be far behind... Wasn't some chap talking about "science fiction" recently here? ... : It's not meant to be an ad hominem attack. The fact is that you have : regularly mischaracterized archaeologists as claiming that transoceanic : contacts were impossible, So are the Aztlan folk saying that it is possible and should be discussed? You know, Peter, they provided the best proof of what I said that I could think of... ... So while we're at it, here're some more quotes from that Kelley article that deal with the points you raised specifically. [begin quote] Underlying all other factors is an intellectual bias that has entered, directly and indirectly, into the training of most anthropologists and archaeologists, at least in North America. This bias of early training continues to affect even those scholars who have adopted theoretical positions of a rather different nature. This is the view that, since culture in the Americas evolved without any outside contacts, the archaeology of the Americas provides us with a "cultural laboratory" in which we can see how human cultures evolve, and which of our characteristics are natural to human beings. ... It is not surprising that scholars whose training was based on this premise -- often explicit, but even more often implicit -- are not willing to give up this view without exceptionally good evidence. (p. 104) The importance of diffusion is not that it introduces concepts that local people were too stupid to word out, but rather that it restricts further and wider developments and constrains future activity. (p. 105) [On p. 105, Kelley cites a passage from Bruce Trigger (A HISTORY OF ARCHAEOLOGICAL THOUGHT, 1989, Cambridge UP, p. 315). Kelley sees that passage as] ...a good example of the orthodox position and of why "establishment" archaeologists are reluctant to consider seriously any opposing interpretations suggesting intercontinental cultural contacts. ... To Bruce Trigger _any_ examination of the possibility of external relationships of any part of the culture of American Indians seems _inherently_ racist, whatever the personal position of a particular writer, and therefore is to be opposed. (p. 105) [end quote] So you see, Peter, this is how the critics of the prevailing paradigm are silenced. This is how things are. But with the recent research about maize arrival to India before Columbus, the tables are reversed. Now it is the people who reject such a possibility out hand who are minimizing the creativity of the American Native, and the contribution of American cultures to the world at large. The Isolationists on Aztlan-l must bear their Eurocentric burden now, IMO. Regards, Yuri. Yuri Kuchinsky | "Where there is the Tree of Knowledge, there -=- | is always Paradise: so say the most ancient in Toronto | and the most modern serpents." F. Nietzsche ----- my webpage is for now at: http://www.io.org/~yuku ----- _________________________________________________________________Click here to go one level up in the directory.